This came up a while back, and I think there were a lot of questions. Tom Tonin is the inventor of this feature on the accordion. I had the accordion in my possession in '98 for about a month with hopes of recording with it, but was never satisfied with the outcome. Tom also pushed Steve Riley to record with it, but Steve didn't like it either. This video was shot ten years ago, and the quality really sucks, but you get the picture.

I played on that Martin. The thing that seems to be missing when people make the notes bend, is some shaking of the bellows. Unfortunately at the time I tried it, I had didn't know how to do that.

It's funny, I tried to pressure Tom into converting one of my accordions after trying it, but several emails went unreplied. Oh well!

I can deal with tight buttons, just to have that feature. It's f'n awesome!

I have a feeling, though, the reeds probably go out of tune easier. What'dya think?

Hi guys, i bough a used Bon Cajun last winter, which had two reeds pitch bending, and puzzled for a while to find the cause. turned out to be loose rivets .... maybe thats the trick? - nout

I had to sign an affidavit saying that I wouldn't open the accordion before Tom would send it to me. He had it all taped up with his signature on it. Pressing the button with more force bends the pitch down approximately one semitone and everywhere in between. Tom swears that this is done without any sort of mechanism touching the reed itself.

It has been ten years. I don't know if his patent has ever gone through, but it seems to me that he is so paranoid about people seeing how it works, he will never sell any. That isn't a very good business plan.

Ganey

True enough! I don't know why he has that extremely long write up on his site about it if he doesn't want to share the creation.

It's like he's saying, "look what I've got, and you're not good enough to have it"

I did a Google patent search right after my last post. Low and behold, a patent has been issued. Of course, when there is a patent, you can view the drawings. I found them very difficult to understand. Maybe some of you engineer types can explain it.

I exchanged a few emails with him years and years ago, and it was the same thing. It was like pulling teeth to get out of him the fact that the bend is activated by pushing harder on the button.

All this time has gone by, and little or nothing has happened. It's a shame, because it is an interesting idea.

That's very cool that you actually had a chance to play it. Thanks for posting the video.

-David

>>
I have a feeling, though, the reeds probably go out of tune easier. What'dya think?
>>

Wrong. Nothing touches the vibrating reed tongue itself (except air, as usual).

Best regards,
Tom

My accordion made a sound a lot like that on a couple reeds when I didnt cut the reed chambers deep enough.

hi bryan ... that's interesting, maybe some experimenting by filling the reed chambers up a little? guess some harmonica types can give a hunch about shape of the chambers regarding airflow, but if the amount of bending is key pressure related it might be a different ball game though. - pitch bending on a harmonica is usually done by changing your mouth's cavity space with your tongue so your chamber size "experiment" might be the way, you might be right there. - maybe with an accordion chamber there's a break-even point below where nothing happens until the airstream gets too much. - this was when i had that loose rivet situation.
- on a a single reed instrument like a clarinet the size of the bore until the first open hole defines the pitch. and the bore shape of cavities in a wind instrument like a clarinet or sax of the sound chamber (the pipe as well as the cavity below the reed) also affects the timbre quite a bit. - could be the reason why Acadians and Martins f.i. sound so different. - maybe you can get some ideas from posters on the Reyes forum; i got some adequate advice there on various repairs etc. from regulars there. and regarding volume, them texmexers are battling with brass instruments and want to get as loud as possible, there might be some ideas to be found regarding that particular subject.
- did you ever notice that Larry Miller uses some cutting out extra wood below where reeds have their largest movement to reduce overall space in a reed chamber? maybe your reed then hit the ceiling, or even not quite but almost, and that this was the cause. - nout

Yup, on my standup reeds the chambers were so shallow I had to cut into the chamber under the pull reeds on the larger reeds to give them room to vibrate. 2 of them would changed pitch on a hard pull until I chiseled some more out, one went high and one went flat. It wasnt exactly the sound as in Ganey's video, but the one that went high was close enough that it might be along those lines. If something hit the reed up at the tip, it should go flat, but if something hit in the middle, it would go high, I believe. That's just an ameteurs speculations, but doesnt that make sense? It would in effect be a large reed with moderate air flow, but a smaller reed with hard flow.

I think the combination of the reed chamber size and the volume of airflow over the reed has merit. Think about how you bend a note on a harmonica. The change of mouth position alters the reed box size and blowing hard or soft in combination with that size change may be the key to that altered sound. So, lets get a sound physics guru to test this one out.

might be he'll find it time for a midi type controller for pitch bend and "expression" built in, maybe with a leslie effect as added "bonus" ....... i'll stick to straight forward one for a while or we might all be playing accordiotic-synths in the future, if there's one in this at all ... nout

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I think the combination of the reed chamber size and the volume of airflow over the reed has merit. Think about how you bend a note on a harmonica. The change of mouth position alters the reed box size and blowing hard or soft in combination with that size change may be the key to that altered sound. So, lets get a sound physics guru to test this one out.

see link #3 - nout

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might be he'll find it time for a midi type controller for pitch bend and "expression" built in, maybe with a leslie effect as added "bonus" ....... i'll stick to straight forward one for a while or we might all be playing accordiotic-synths in the future, if there's one in this at all ... nout

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Replying to:

I think the combination of the reed chamber size and the volume of airflow over the reed has merit. Think about how you bend a note on a harmonica. The change of mouth position alters the reed box size and blowing hard or soft in combination with that size change may be the key to that altered sound. So, lets get a sound physics guru to test this one out.

Yes, he was unwilling to build or convert one for me. In the end..after much listening, I decided not only was I not interested, but personally I found it sounded .. artificial.. contrived.. unnatural.. and kinda silly.

Boxes aren't for bending.. harmonicas do it better.

Glenn

well i think it sounds pretty crappy why would u want to ruin a good traditional song by makeing it sound like that u didnt see iry lejeune trying to bend some notes like hes jimmy hendrix are something

The problem with note bending on a four stop accordion is: you're dealing with four seperate reeds at the same time.
The change of air flow necessary to "bend" each reed is different, depending on the size of the reed. What I hear on the vidio from Ganey, is the reeds bending, but at different pitches at the same time. Yes, they are bending, but they're no longer in tune with each other. Not very pleasing to an old harmonica player like me. With a harmonica, you're bending one note, and are in total control of the pitch. I just don't see how one could control the pitch of 4 reeds at the same time.
Just my opinion, but I didn't hear anything to get excited about.
Jude

Hi Jude,

You make an astute and correct observation. Getting all four reeds to bend at precisely the same rate is very challenging, and in the prototype Dirk used in the video, the musical tone during the bend does change in "wetness" for perhaps most of the notes. Like you, I particularly like the "sound of one reed bending," which that prototype can do in any of the single four reed registers available. Cajun accordion music, however, is uncompromising in its demand for the "four reed sound." Your comment is one reason why this technology can be more easily and less expensively adapted to Conjunto or Jazz, where one playing reed is not a serious handicap, if not an advantage. I expect that the precision of the multi-reed bend can be greatly improved over Dirk's ten-year-old prototype, though on the plus side, I still use that particular prototype, and it's operation has been extremely stable, with no significant changes in its tuning or pitch-bend mechanism. I assure you that I've hammered on that keyboard quite a bit, and it has proven itself extremely robust and durable.

Best regards,
Tom

yep, i can imagine getting all 4 to bend the same amount at the same time is pretty near impossible

one type of harmonica bend, the so-called 'blow bend' [ you can actually bend the high notes on the blow, not the draw] is said to involve changing the place where the airstream hits the reed, by changing your blowing

so maybe it works like that - changing the place where the air stream hits the reed

the problem with harmonica in general is that no one can actually see what a player is doing, and the player doesn;t really know either - you try things out, and it just happens

wle.

Hi Ganey,

Nice to hear from you after all these years. Thanks for putting up the video link here; I was planning to do it myself and then noticed this thread. As can be sampled from some of the responses here, the applicability of a pitch bending accordion to traditional Cajun music still has its controversy, which I think suggests that pitch bending is my no means a trivial modification of the accordion as a musical instrument. When I first conceived of the invention, I wasn't very familiar to cajun music, being challenged to perhaps make a significant contribution to the evolution of accordion music in general, and blues in particular. For some of the people here, it may be helpful to realize that I'm not a musical instrument company, but an average person, with a full time job, many interests, and little time to waste. I'm sure you can understand that where I put my time in developing the technology depends greatly on the potential benefits I see both to the musician and to the musical genre he or she works in. Thus, at present, I feel my time is best spent focusing in the near future mainly on Conjunto and Jazz. I cannot, however, rule out the possibility that a serious and innovative Cajun musician would show me a particular interest in this technology, but unfortunately this hasn't really happened yet.

Best regards,
Tom

Tom,
Good to hear from you as well. I am glad you respond because I am certain there will be questions that I cannot answer.

What is the definition of a serious and innovative Cajun musician?

I love playing Cajun music and also would love to work on mastering the 'bend' with Cajun music.

I have a couple Cajun accordion recordings on my site linked above and below.

We've met a couple times before at the King of Prussia accordion festival. At the time I didn't have a clue how to play, but I've put my heart and soul into it as of the past 6 years. Anyway, you gave me your email at the time, but I never got any replies to one's I sent.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=126996941

Well..I play quite a bit of Blues/Country Style Harp in our Band....and bending sounds pretty darned good .....in moderation.

But I gotta say, IMHO, that if that's the best those pitch bending accordions can sound well I say he can have the Patent.. Not even Dirk Powell can make it sound REALLY good...as a matter of fact, I think it's a very annoying sound even in the hands of a brilliant musician like Dirk...a bending harp kills it for impact and effect.

I think a better strategy for the Cajun Accordion will be to get away from it being a box or regulation cube... a design issue that I've been thinking about is softening and radicalising the shape, and working on the ergonomics ( one day Jude I'll send you some ideas and you tell me why it can't be done and how much it'd cost if you could !! but promise you won't laugh.. LOL ).

..while at the same time installing an on-board EQ just like they have on acoustic electric guitars, for instance ,with sliders for hi/mids/ low / brightness and gain/level.

But that's going down a whole different road from the topic so I'll let it be.

All I see though is that accordion makers, possibly due to tradition and commercial realities, are sort of nibbling at the edges with aesthetics variations when perhaps a more groundbreaking path needs to be followed...particularly for the next generation of young dudes ..eg. Briggs Brown, Guyland Ledet etc etc who may ultimately demand change if they're to remain interested..

And what I wouldn't give for an on- board control to make minor adjustments to tone and levels during the course of a song without having to dive for the mixing desk/ EQ Pedal or signal frantically to sound guys.

Time for a cold beer. !!

Darryl.

Hi Y'all - pitch bending, i don't think it's useful besides for single reed instruments anyway. - Now this probably has been discussed before:
- I think the design as used for Louisiana built Cajun Accordions is almost near perfect considering weight & size, amount of reeds used to get that sound, being quick on the draw with the pull spring system for the keys, the type of reed block construction for faster & direct reed response, and especially after (i think its Marc Savoy's doing) incorporating better sounding and responding Italian reeds than most German built ones had in present and past, except maybe for some old pre WW2 hohner made ones.
- Now I still wonder why every quality Louisiana builder constructs the stops pulled up configuration for full sound instead of down, as with most Chinamen and Weltmeisters etc. Occasionally you'll start playing forgetting to check if the stops are completely in up position, when your weapon just came out of the box. And i have an Acadian with lazy ones too. Rubber bands do wonders though. - Nout

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Replying to:

Well..I play quite a bit of Blues/Country Style Harp in our Band....and bending sounds pretty darned good .....in moderation.

But I gotta say, IMHO, that if that's the best those pitch bending accordions can sound well I say he can have the Patent.. Not even Dirk Powell can make it sound REALLY good...as a matter of fact, I think it's a very annoying sound even in the hands of a brilliant musician like Dirk...a bending harp kills it for impact and effect.

I think a better strategy for the Cajun Accordion will be to get away from it being a box or regulation cube... a design issue that I've been thinking about is softening and radicalising the shape, and working on the ergonomics ( one day Jude I'll send you some ideas and you tell me why it can't be done and how much it'd cost if you could !! but promise you won't laugh.. LOL ).

..while at the same time installing an on-board EQ just like they have on acoustic electric guitars, for instance ,with sliders for hi/mids/ low / brightness and gain/level.

But that's going down a whole different road from the topic so I'll let it be.

All I see though is that accordion makers, possibly due to tradition and commercial realities, are sort of nibbling at the edges with aesthetics variations when perhaps a more groundbreaking path needs to be followed...particularly for the next generation of young dudes ..eg. Briggs Brown, Guyland Ledet etc etc who may ultimately demand change if they're to remain interested..

And what I wouldn't give for an on- board control to make minor adjustments to tone and levels during the course of a song without having to dive for the mixing desk/ EQ Pedal or signal frantically to sound guys.

Time for a cold beer. !!

Darryl.

Yeah Tom..fair call...appreciate you comments.

I guess when I was mentioning design issues with the accordion it sorta comes in two areas for me.

Design aesthetics....ie. vary the visual presentation of the instrument by ' morphing ' it's shape . Bit like bring out a new model car...some panel shape changes , stretched here, curved there. Which is different from, say, keeping the same shape car and only offering a colour variation and new badges and grille.
It can still be a gas guzzlin' Corvette....but at least it's outer skin has changed to appeal to the market and the times.

This is only a design and presentation issue.. HOWEVER..I think? it can be linked with an ergonomics thing as well. eg. look at the 3D shape of your hand and fingers when you make a fist then open up your hand partially. The shape lends itself to curves and arcs.

I actually think the sound and internal mechanics of the Cajun Accordion are great..I wouldn't fundamentally change anything there . The only internal changes would possibly be to accommodate design issues externally....but nothing would change re the sound and power of the accordion.

As far as the stops are concerned... personally I like them UP..it sorta sends a message out that your pullin' out all stops. And yes, it's a real pain when you start a song and find that inadvertantly one of the stops isn't fully up. I guess that's just being careful about things before you start a song....however, I wonder if there's a fail safe way of alerting the player to a partial reed event....red light on the dash board or something..I dunno...

All I know is that in the helter skelter of some gigs when there's a full dance floor, they're looking at you for more and you've just completed a significant instrument change for the next song it's tempting to just start....and overlook the small things like stop heights..( especially when the stage and ambient light level is just average and I'm not wearing my reading glasses and visually from above the accordion, once strapped on, the stops are the same colour as the accordion )...well it can be for me sometimes I'm afraid..LOL.
As you well know..you ain't got a free hand for adjustments once you open up the intro.....be nice to have a warning light sometimes!!

That's it for me....breakfast time and a hot coffee awaits.

Darryl.

aye, stops down, i'd go for stops down let the rest be - nout

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Yeah Tom..fair call...appreciate you comments.

I guess when I was mentioning design issues with the accordion it sorta comes in two areas for me.

Design aesthetics....ie. vary the visual presentation of the instrument by ' morphing ' it's shape . Bit like bring out a new model car...some panel shape changes , stretched here, curved there. Which is different from, say, keeping the same shape car and only offering a colour variation and new badges and grille.
It can still be a gas guzzlin' Corvette....but at least it's outer skin has changed to appeal to the market and the times.

This is only a design and presentation issue.. HOWEVER..I think? it can be linked with an ergonomics thing as well. eg. look at the 3D shape of your hand and fingers when you make a fist then open up your hand partially. The shape lends itself to curves and arcs.

I actually think the sound and internal mechanics of the Cajun Accordion are great..I wouldn't fundamentally change anything there . The only internal changes would possibly be to accommodate design issues externally....but nothing would change re the sound and power of the accordion.

As far as the stops are concerned... personally I like them UP..it sorta sends a message out that your pullin' out all stops. And yes, it's a real pain when you start a song and find that inadvertantly one of the stops isn't fully up. I guess that's just being careful about things before you start a song....however, I wonder if there's a fail safe way of alerting the player to a partial reed event....red light on the dash board or something..I dunno...

All I know is that in the helter skelter of some gigs when there's a full dance floor, they're looking at you for more and you've just completed a significant instrument change for the next song it's tempting to just start....and overlook the small things like stop heights..( especially when the stage and ambient light level is just average and I'm not wearing my reading glasses and visually from above the accordion, once strapped on, the stops are the same colour as the accordion )...well it can be for me sometimes I'm afraid..LOL.
As you well know..you ain't got a free hand for adjustments once you open up the intro.....be nice to have a warning light sometimes!!

That's it for me....breakfast time and a hot coffee awaits.

Darryl.

That would throw everyone who uses the stops as handles for a loop.

My next box I make for me will have the stops down to play.

hi Bryan i'll start saving. howzabout a conversion kit? But this lil' feller wont need his stops down ... link #3 -nout

heck, somebody put his stops (and keyboard) on the wrong side. That kid is some kind of amazing.