Well, been beating on my old Hohner 114 and just when I thought I was getting a couple of songs down, and in the meantime wondering why I was pretty much playing just the 3,4, and 5 buttons, I watched Dirk Powell's video and went through Big Nick's (thanks by the way Nick) site and discovered this octave thing. Wow does that throw a wrench in my fingers.

My question is, am I better off not trying to play single fingers at all and just concentrate on the octaves? I did try one song that I had learned with single fingers(using index, middle, and ring) and first played it a few times with just my index finger, then tried the octaves and that seemed to help. So that makes me wonder if learning one will help the other.

Also, on the Hohner 114, should all the stops be pulled out, or should the 1st one be down (or any)?

Thanks in advance and sorry for the amateurish questions, but rather get on the right track early than have to derail later.

Bryan,

There are many different schools of thought regarding octaves vs single notes. The craze seems to be playing in octaves. I think what hasn't been emphasized in the instructional videos is that playing octaves is an "element" of playing Cajun style accordion and not the sum of it. The players of the world range from Marc Savoy's monstrous hand playing a multitude of octaves to August Broussard playing little if any. Both are very expressive players. I think it is important to be familiar with the mechanics of both. It provides for more emotional playing because a series of single notes stand out in the middle of a bunch of octaves, and vice versa.

Learn 'em both. You'll find that while playing on the 5,6 and 7 buttons you will travel up the top half of the keyboard periodically. When you are doing that it is just a matter of planting the pinky in the right place.

Good Luck!

Most play with all the stops pulled. Play what sounds good to you. I learned the octaves first and have a habit of over doing it with them. Not so on my triple row. I don't use the little finger way as much with that.
Craig

I knew most people who play Louisiana accordions play with all stops out, but this sounds a little more bassy to me with the top stop out. When I got it, it had the top stop in and all the others out. I havent heard enough accordions up close when I was really listening to be able to tell for sure.

I learned octaves immediately using Dirk Powell's video and only later discovered two perfectly good finger in between those used for octaves. Now I do both. It is all a part of the music and as you progress and learn more tunes your playing will change to accomodate what you need to do. Enjoy.
Leslie

CHECK OUT ALMENAPICTURES.COM and Wilson SAvoy's new accordion video.

What skill level is his lessons?

He's got a sample clip on the website. You can probably gauge if what he's doing, and how he's doing it, is right for you. He's also got lessons you can download (and a sample) in mp3 format.

Bryan, seems to me for what it's worth that the octave position is crucial to a lot of those triplets and embelishments typical of Cajun & Zydeco accordion. I'd recommend if you don't already have it that you get the "J'ai Ete Au Bal" DVD and check out Marc Savoy's "Melville 2-step" and Paul D'aigle's "Rayne One-Step". Slow it down if you need to and if you can. Forget Dirk Powell, the secret is in those two or three clips (including Savoy's sort of Cajun accordion 101 3-step intro to Cajun music).
You can do whatever you want with it later but my humble suggestion, learn EVERYTHING OCTAVE and move away from it later. It'll be easier than the other way 'round.
Happy squeezin,
JP

Bryan..this is what works for me...

I usually try to learn the melody first using one finger...than as SOON as i can do the tune with one finger i go directly to octaves and never go back.

learn the full scale in octaves to where it is second nature, i usually start my practice sessions a few octave scales, Big Nicks site was very helpful for me on this.

I guess I kind of buried it in my post above, so I will extract and distill (as in: oversimplify) the advice I received from Ray Abshire the other day:

Use octaves frequently, but also use chords (blends of two or three notes from a chord) on both the push and pull. Work the dickens out of the seven button. In other words, explore the world of the buttons in between the four-or-five button octave spread.

Don't do anything (like triplets) all the time and everywhere: do them when they feel right to you.

There are a bunch of great players out there, and they all have different techniques, including some who get lots out of single-note playing. I'm just passing on part of the lecture I got after Ray heard my herky-jerky handiwork!

Definately get comfortable with octaves, and experiment with more and less use of same (my advice).

Not so unimportantly, Ray was explaining what comes first in knowing and playing a song, and he first pointed to his heart, then got his foot tapping, then got the bass working, and finally hit the treble buttons. Point being that the soul and rhythm of the song are the underpinnings of expression you might find in the melody.

Californians: go to that workshop!!!

S'b'B

Every now & then I read something on here that's a real Gem. Your recalling of Ray's order of learning a song (heart, foot, bass, & treble) is such a Gem. Just in those few jestures, he expressed a lot of information. I'll be thinking about that one for a long time. Thank you very much for writing about that. --Tommee

Bryan, while certainly no expert by any means, I started out playing the simple single notes and very quickly went on to octaves with the help of Larry's book and Dirks video. The simple beauty of octaves is that one simple rule always applies: a push octave is two fingers apart, a pull octave is three. Once you get the feel of that it is very easy and very natural to work up and down the scale on your push and pulls. If you are playing a push octave and want to drop one note, move your index finger up one. Want to go up a note, move your pinky. Practice simple scales up and down the finger board in this way, and once you get the natural feel of it you won't ever want to go back to singles. Actually, the octaves have gotten to feel so natural that I have difficulty playing single finger on any of the songs in my whopping 5 song repertoire.

Now I just need to figger out what to do with the two in fingers in between.

Hal

Thanks to all the replies. You have given me determination. The songs are in my head, I just have to make my fingers cooperate. As my old pop always tells me, you gotta get to where your fingers just do what they are supposed to without you thinking about it.

Though I have been heavily exposed to music most of my life I never tried to play anything until recently, or learn anything about all the mechanics and terminology of the actual playing it. For that this forum has been a gold mine.

Yes, I agree this forum has been a gold mine of information which has kept me going in times of frustration, although some of the masters that post here have indeed been very humbling.

One thing I forget to mention that I learned (in my very limited knowledge/experience) when playing octaves is the concept of "The Cajun Bouncing Finger". When you are holding an octave on either the push or the pull, and you want 8th/16th notes, all you need to do is "bounce" your index finger in time with the music. It makes the higher tempo notes much easier to keep up with.

Now if someone could provide some advice on how to master what I do with the two remaining fingers, and how to figure out how to keep my left hand in synch with what I right hand is doing, I would be eternally grateful.



Hal