Hello,

My interest is in your Vienna Model 114. I believe it was once called the HA-114.
Is the Vienna Model the same as the old type HA-114's in tuning and construction?
I've have seen and played on the Model HA-114's several times and even purchased a full set of these particular reeds to be put inside a Louisiana made Cajun accordion. The experiment went well and the sound of the "Acadian" accordion is great. There was a loss of power after the smaller 114 reeds were put in, but the result is still satisfactory and merits the attention from those that would hear it being played.

At one time there was an HA-114B model offered by Hohner. It was the same design as the HA-114, except for being (B) black. I was wondering if Hohner ever reconsidered bringing the HA-114B back for customers to purchase. Except this time, make it strictly a "Cajun" traditional design, which would entail the removal of the finger board grill, the set up of the base/air control side with (designed to last) buttons instead of paddles, and lastly, better strapping throughout the accordion. (thumbstrap, base side strap, and closing straps for the bellows).

Gabenelli Accordions have designed such an accordion called the "Cajun King". The construction is almost on par with Louisiana handmade accordions. These Kings can be retuned and restrapped and the result is an accordion that performs very well and looks like most Cajun accordions. They were priced at about $900.00 last I purchased one. If Hohner had offered a similar design, I would have purchased a Hohner "Cajun" 114B instead because of the more majestic reputation and sound of Hohner 114 model accordions.

The reason I was wondering if Hohner would ever consider creating a Cajun model out of the HA-114B is because of the current pricing of Louisiana handmade accordions. It has gotten out of control due to the influx of accordion players from around the world taking interest in our Cajun culture and music. Cajun handmades once went for $800 to $1,200 only a few years ago. Now, they have moved closer to and surpassed the $2,000 mark, and in my opinion, still can be unpredictable and sometimes upsetting in performance. In other words, the product didn't increase in performance and durability, only the price increased due to the new demand.

I have always felt that Hohner 114 models had a beautiful, soulful sound that most everyone can appreciate. I believe it is the 114 reeds and tuning, and the reed blocks set up and wood used in the 114's that make this instrument the way it is. The only setback of the 114's in my past experience was the strapping, the grill, and the paddles instead of buttons on the base side. It is my belief that if Hohner were to produce a top quality "Cajun" 114 model to replace the poor quality China made "Ariette" accordion and kept the price fairly close to that of the 114 models, then Hohner and many accordion players worldwide would benefit by the availability of this superior instrument.

Please consider this further. I believe it would make a great comeback instrument for the Hohner Company and also for Hohner customers geared towards purchasing Cajun accordions.

Sincerely,
????????
The Guy Who Posted This Thread on Bravenet for everyone and his brother to see and give pressure to Hohner USA on getting the done!!

There's definitely a market for cheaper accordions, and the only way to make them is to mass produce them, and that will only happen with a large company like Hohner. But I wonder if the market is too small for Hohner, considering how small the Cajun music world is, and that so many do buy handmades.

But the only way even Hohner can make an accordion that cheap is to use cheaper components. Which is apparent in a few spots. But I agree on the sound, I do like the sound of a Hohner with the right tuning. My biggest complaint is Hohner reeds aren't as responsive as most Italian reeds.

If they get back to me on that email, I will suggest maybe a "Limited Edition" model. If it's successful, Hohner benefits from the attention and the "Cajun" genre gets a renewed view of what a Hohner 114 can actually be. But it has to be in "classic black" without the gold stamping all over it. Only the basic corner trim and the fingers and what-not trimmed in gold plate.

I also read on the Hohner website that they now have a customizing shop. Why not make these new line Cajun 114's available to be customized for customers willing to pay a little more for the improvements?
I think I'd actually break down and buy one and play it exclusively at every jam I'd attend just to try to make it stick.

And if Hohner wants to pay me a little on the side for my suggestion and for performing with their product, I don't think I'd have a problem accepting their money! LOL.

Then, I would have bargaining power. I could see it now.....Hey Mr. Savoy...if you wanted to, I could stop performing on this here Hohner and start performing on your Acadian brand if you're willing to pay me more than Hohner. LMAO! Yeah right, only in my dreams and in a much much better, more understanding world.

Hohner USA's tech -- Tim -- will very likely have something to say. I think that Hohner should make a box for Cajun + Quebec markets. In Quebec, the practice is for music stores like Messervier to remove the "spoon basses" and make button basses, and to do some work on the tuning + action. There are many old HA-114s in Quebec that have been "learner" boxes for generations of learners until they upgrade to a locally made box, at which time the HA-114 is traded in, passed to a nephew etc or sold 2nd hand.
-Andy

This is a diuscussion I,and many other people, have had with Hohner.

I woudl suggest you direct your e-mail to Gilbert Reyes.
He is the Accordeon Developement Mgr for Hohner US and wears many hats. He was responsible for the new Hohner 3 row XTREME series.

Hohner has slowly been uopgrading and last I spoke with Gilbert I strongly suggested a reintroduction of the HA114 not necessarily a B which was NOT Cajun tuned but simply drier with a supposed all black upgraded bellows

One thing Hohner will not do is upgrade the reeds as they believe this gives the Hohner its signature sound. This is direct from Gilbert. But they certainly could tune them better. Drier and moire accurately and offer a "Cajun" tuning option

I like the spoons.. they work and look good and are easily repaired. I think that the materials could be improved such as are used on the van der Leeuw boxes from the Netherlands.

As to the Gabbanelli Cajun King... not the same design as the Hohner.. it has removeable blocks and some other features that differentiate it form the Hohner

I owned one and played others. I prefer the Hohner Ha114 over the Cajun King... which is no King and certainly isnt Cajun..
Suggesting Hohner emulate that mediocre unit is paramount to insult.

Good luck in your quest

Matter of fact call Gilbert Reyes, he is very approachable.

Tim is a decent tech but is not in a position to
mandate change.

Right, Tim isn't in charge of design changes (neither is Gilbert, but you're right, he is higher up), however, Tim has been passing his ideas to higher management and can therefore speak to the reasons he has been given why this upgraded beginners box hasn't happened yet! I spoke to him at length about the ideas he has for Hohner, and pretty much everything mentioned here has already been considered by him and discussed at Hohner. Nothing new under the sun, and no reason to reinvent the wheel.

No, reinventing the wheel is not necessary, but trying out a different set of tires every once in a while would be nice.

Has anyone here ever once questioned the tones of the musical scale (soffregio scale: doe, re, mi, fa, se, la, ti, doe)? Do we really know that they are as perfect as they can be? What is to say that they could have been farther evolved, thus making music all over this world BETTER!?

Is the tuning that we tend to accept and (not accept) on the accordions we buy correct, or can it be better?
For some reason, Hohner 114's call out to my instincts and say "PAY ATTENTION TO ME! I AM DIFFERENT! My tone, sound, and feel are a product of advanced musical evolution, but I need help to become even better.

Do not sell short the amount of influence Hohner has had on Louisiana accordion builders. It has played a part! Maybe....too small of a part.

One more thought or question. Who influenced who? Or who came first? The Germans or the Italians. (reeds and tunings)

Me thinks it all started with the Chinese Sheng .....





Next of kin to a cajun accordion?:



- Nout

Yes but not bellows driven which is a basic definition of an accordeon or melodeon...

So that is where DL Menard got the tune for the Back Door!!

Who came first...
Armenian immigrants to Austria followed by Saxons, Germans, Austrians, Czechs, Bohemians then, much later...Italians...

sol F ege not solf R ege....FYI

In my expereince the main dissent I have heard about the Hohner and specifically the HA 114 comes from Cajuns...
look in the older posts on this site...
endless criticism....

I very much like the Hohner HA 114 and prefer it to many Cajun made boxes I have played.
Simple and unpretentious and a good value.

Many early Cajun made accordeons used Hohner reeds and components. I see a reluctance of modern builders to pay due respect to Hohner.
I would venture to say there are more Hohner HA 114's in the hands of Cajun style players than there are so called "hand made" Cajun accordeons.

Hohners are simple and well made, easy to fix and mod...light fast fun and good resale...

Tim has made a very positive change at Hohner and that is due in part to Gilbert Reyes having the foresight to hire him. Tim knows his stuff.

I think that the "suits" at Hohner Germany still pull the strings and are as clueless as "suits" in any industry. And of course being German.. well...

I understand that Hohner USA will be introducing an upgraded Erica specifically for the Merengue Tipico
Dominican style of play..
There is no reason they cannot improve the HA 114..
I think there is a significant marketing potential for a good HA 114 as not everyone is so enamoured of a "hand made LA box" or can afford something better such as a MELODIE or a Castagnari

Gabbanelli's Cajun King is pathetic given its price.. grossly overpriced...and the importer undercuts his own dealers.. see e-bay..
It has some positive features but is no value.
And couple that with the importer/distributor and legendary customer service or lack thereof..
no thanks...

Thanks for the info Jeff. I'll keep it stored for use when the time presents itself. I agree with much of it.

The thing about the Kings....No, they don't come tuned right. They have to be retuned, and a more conservative strap job helps their appearance. If not, you get what looks like a Mexican accordion. The one I have is a Black "D" that has been restrapped and retuned with the same reeds it came with. Greg Mouton north of Crowley did a fine job with the tuning. The only thing about it is the lack of power. You have to play it hard to get loud volume. Otherwise, these Kings handle very well and come with a fantastic button and spring setting for my taste. They have the perfect sized base box grip. They also have that "light weight" feel to them. I just wish they sounded more like the 114 to start with. A little adjustment from there would make a very acceptable box. Thanks again.

Hi Hebert,

I hope your letter is read by Hohner and that they do something as you suggest.

My first accordion was one of the HA-114B's, that I bought in 1990 for $325 from Elderly Instruments. I have heavily customized it to be more like a LA accordion (removed grill, added real bass box with buttons instead of spoons, etc.) I still play it now and then.

Unfortunately, I suspect your entreaties will fall on deaf ears at Hohner. I met the guy that runs the accordion side of things at the NAMM show a while back (mid to late 90's). He was friendly, but it was clear that he and Hohner didn't really give a **** about accordions any more. Too bad. It wasn't that long ago that Hohner accordions set the standard by which other brands were judged. Now, they are an embarrassment!

-David

I believe you may be right friend about my email falling on deaf ears because those guys haven't responded back to me yet. Well, they will make their own bed... Let them lie in it too if that's how they want to be.

Elderly Instruments? Thats a pretty cool place for someone wanting to buy a fiddle. Do they have accordions too? I had been to their website by instruction of David Greely a while back. Many good looking fiddles there and they're willing to ship them out on consignment to you so you can decide if you want the instrument or not.

Thanks for the post.

I worked with Hohner in 2006 for over a year on the xtreme IIIN and IIIV ,supreme,re del vallenato and comrade models.. the design features .. even helped name them. they came to italy .. I went to Germany.. was an amazing experience.. and was purely on a volunteer basis.

Glenn

Fact

Upon request,
I contributed quite a bit to this project and much of what I contributed was later proposed by others who took credit.

Gilbert Reyes ( and others ) are/is now fully aware of this.

The one thing Mr Reyes said they would not do, change the reeds to a better quality as it would remove the signature Hohner sound

Fact.

"said they would not do, change the reeds to a better quality as it would remove the signature Hohner sound"

Probably so, but doesn't Hohner have better quality reeds of their own? If so, wouldn't that give better performance and keep the tone?

You know what's funny? A year ago I tried a box that was modified (for fun) by Tim, one of Hohner's techs. It was a Corona. He had added buttons to the keyboard, modified the bass, and most crucially, tuned it. I don't know what kind of magic he had worked, but I thought he had put special reeds in the box -- nope, just standard Hohner reeds. Amazingly responsive.
A good tech/tuner can really work wonders!

It's no secret to anyone who's piddled with these contraptions that there is an aweful lot of room for tricks of the trade, lots of little variables that make a difference. Boy I'd love to apprentice with someone like that for a bit.